Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

  • Advertisement

HB Store


User avatar
mt008
ProStaff
Posts: 1082
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:53 pm
Location: WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby mt008 » Thu May 25, 2017 1:07 am

Hello,

The pod cast is now available on the beast as well as spreaker and youtube.

Link to HB: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel


User avatar
purebowhunting
500 Club
Posts: 902
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:37 am
Location: Wisconsin
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby purebowhunting » Thu May 25, 2017 1:14 am

Really enjoyed the podcast, enjoy info on tracking. One question I have is dealing with bait sites. When you take a track into a bait site that's being hunted actively by a territorial hunter how do you handle this. Try to circle out of sight and pick up the track, just pass through with the mentality its public land and you have as much right to be there than them? I hate confrontation so this is intimidating for myself especially with all the crazies in the world and knowing they have a weapon.
cedarsavage
500 Club
Posts: 1037
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2015 6:42 am
Facebook: No facebook
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby cedarsavage » Thu May 25, 2017 2:23 am

Awesome podcast magic thanks for taking the time to do it. Definitely the most helpful podcast for hunting big woods. It's great to get info from someone who has been there and done it. Big things I take away, gloves (sounds like a good setup you have), getting rid of the sling I can see what you mean about shaking the rifle, deliberate movements of bigger bucks, choosing tracks wisely, aging tracks, just plain getting out and doing it "you can't learn it in a book."
User avatar
Jonny
500 Club
Posts: 1030
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:11 am
Location: Milwaukee
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby Jonny » Thu May 25, 2017 3:33 am

purebowhunting wrote:Really enjoyed the podcast, enjoy info on tracking. One question I have is dealing with bait sites. When you take a track into a bait site that's being hunted actively by a territorial hunter how do you handle this. Try to circle out of sight and pick up the track, just pass through with the mentality its public land and you have as much right to be there than them? I hate confrontation so this is intimidating for myself especially with all the crazies in the world and knowing they have a weapon.


Definitely avoid confrontation. Acknowledge you saw him, a slight wave is all you need. Back up, and circle around out of sight. People get really weird on public land, especially when bait is involved. The only time I ever keep walking is if it is an obvious logging trail. Never had an issue doing this, and when I run into the guys back at the truck, most are very happy I didn't walk through "their" area. Only guy that got mad was a guided bear hunter who never made a noise when my dad set up 60 yards from him. Opening day, and zero chance to see him.

You are not in the wrong by continuing your tracking, but I wouldn't feel comfortable walking in sight of somebody who is hunting. I hate that being watched feeling.
"Get busy living or get busy dying"
User avatar
stash59
500 Club
Posts: 4979
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:22 am
Location: S Central Wi.
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby stash59 » Thu May 25, 2017 7:23 am

Todd thanx ever so much for taking the time to do this. Gonna have to listen to this multiple times.

As an older guy that has always been a "wanna be" Benoit, but was afraid of doing it wrong. You've showed that "just doing" it is the best way to go. Just a thought for the younger guys!!! I know I regret not just getting out there and trying it more.

Some questions. Do you have a certain circuit you plan on covering in the truck each day to look for tracks for each state? Or do you just kinda go where your gut tells you or even on a whim. How long is it? How often do you get out of the truck and just walk to find a fresh track?

How big are the chunks of ground without roads you'll hunt? Or do you base it more on the area being desolate despite a road or even a highway going through it.

Do you take into account the stride width of a buck? If so what's a good bucks stride width? And as long as I'm talking numbers. Do you have any for stride lengths that make you stop and take notice? I know you said that it varies depending on how fresh or tired the buck is. How much can it vary?

Do you see the same exact circuits being run by different bucks over a period of years? Or are the truly large tracked bucks so rare that you don't find them in the same places. Or are they so individual in where they choose to roam that only major terrain features like the river crossings you mentioned the only common travel areas.

With security being their primary concern. Do you still kinda see the bucks taking the path of least resistance whenever possible? If so do you use this to cyber scout for new areas? What really jumps out at you on a aerial or topo to make you consider it may hold mature bucks to hunt?

Guess you really got me thinking. You got time to write a book? LOL I'd buy it? You brought up alot of stuff I hadn't heard or read before.

Thanx again for all of the info. Mario thanx for hosting. It's gotta take abit of time to organize all of these. :clap: :clap: :clap: :handgestures-thumbup: :handgestures-thumbup: :handgestures-thumbup: :text-bravo:
Happiness is a large gutpile!!!!!!!
User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 3072
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Online

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby Hawthorne » Thu May 25, 2017 7:44 am

Good podcast! Took me two times to finish. I like you mentioned sounding like a deer when walking in crunchy leaves. I've done it. I read about years ago in Fred Asbels book on stalking and ground hunting. You put your toe down first in the crunchy leaves then snap your heel down. Then repeat.sounds just like a deer. I've set up up close to bedding doing this and have had deer come under my stand that evening.
Take your bow and a quiver full of arrows, and go out into the open country to hunt some wild game for me.

Genesis27:3
User avatar
Singing Bridge
500 Club
Posts: 5966
Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 3:11 pm
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/pro ... 1329617473
Location: MidMichigan
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby Singing Bridge » Thu May 25, 2017 1:19 pm

Crazy busy with work and kids... but this is one podcast I will get to no matter what. There is no hunter I respect more than Todd.
www.stealthoutdoors.com
User avatar
magicman54494
500 Club
Posts: 3192
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: central and northern WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby magicman54494 » Thu May 25, 2017 1:23 pm

purebowhunting wrote:Really enjoyed the podcast, enjoy info on tracking. One question I have is dealing with bait sites. When you take a track into a bait site that's being hunted actively by a territorial hunter how do you handle this. Try to circle out of sight and pick up the track, just pass through with the mentality its public land and you have as much right to be there than them? I hate confrontation so this is intimidating for myself especially with all the crazies in the world and knowing they have a weapon.


Bait hunters usually only hunt the last few hours each day. Most of the time no one is there when I come thru. If i do come across another hunter I try to circle wide and pick up the track further down the line. One bait hunter tried to kick me off public land by telling me it was private. I didn't push the issue but he was informed that there are hunter harassment laws and I would make a call if bothered again.
Stay thirsty my friend



Deflating lungs since 1975
User avatar
magicman54494
500 Club
Posts: 3192
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: central and northern WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby magicman54494 » Thu May 25, 2017 2:04 pm

stash59 wrote:Todd thanx ever so much for taking the time to do this. Gonna have to listen to this multiple times.

You are welcome


stash59 wrote: Do you have a certain circuit you plan on covering in the truck each day to look for tracks for each state? Or do you just kinda go where your gut tells you or even on a whim. How long is it? How often do you get out of the truck and just walk to find a fresh track?


It varies. There are days that I drive all day and never find a good track. I tend to go to places where I have history on certain bucks. I will get out and walk to spots that I know a buck is using to see if he came thru. Sometimes if I can't find a good track I will follow a lesser buck to see if he leads me to a better one. this happens a lot. I switch tracks whenever I find a better one. I usually don't follow lesser bucks but if I haven't been on a good one for a few days I like to stretch my legs.

stash59 wrote:How big are the chunks of ground without roads you'll hunt? Or do you base it more on the area being desolate despite a road or even a highway going through it.


I tend to hunt the biggest blocks because I don't like running into private land most of it is national forest. many miles in each direction. I do hunt some edges of private especially if I know a good buck is bedding there. I will check to see if he came in or out. I will take a chance if private is near and the buck is real big. If he goes on the private that's just the way the ball bounces sometimes.

stash59 wrote:Do you take into account the stride width of a buck? If so what's a good bucks stride width? And as long as I'm talking numbers. Do you have any for stride lengths that make you stop and take notice? I know you said that it varies depending on how fresh or tired the buck is. How much can it vary?


I measure it. two boots long is a nice walking stride. You will have to measure my boots to get an exact number. size 10 alphas. I don't really much care how long the stride is. if the track is big I take it. Stride width is not very exact. I've seen big bucks with narrow width and small bucks with wide width. I really haven't noticed a width change when they are tired but what you will see is arcing drag marks. What I do see when they are tired is they lay back on their dews a lot more and when they are fresh they stand more on their toes.

stash59 wrote:Do you see the same exact circuits being run by different bucks over a period of years? Or are the truly large tracked bucks so rare that you don't find them in the same places. Or are they so individual in where they choose to roam that only major terrain features like the river crossings you mentioned the only common travel areas.


There are crossings that are used by multiple bucks. These are spots where they almost need to cross there to get from one area to another. Each buck seems to define his own area and how he travels it.

stash59 wrote:With security being their primary concern. Do you still kinda see the bucks taking the path of least resistance whenever possible? If so do you use this to cyber scout for new areas? What really jumps out at you on a aerial or topo to make you consider it may hold mature bucks to hunt?


Old buck will take the SAFEST path of least resistance. They mainly travel at night and will often walk right down the logging roads. Most areas will hold one good buck if there is cover and feed. One area I hunt right now holds a good one every 2 -3 square miles. There is so much land that it is real hard to look at a map and say a big one will be here. I just assume there is a good one there somewhere and check the EDGES.

stash59 wrote:You got time to write a book?

I think you just made me. lol
Stay thirsty my friend



Deflating lungs since 1975
User avatar
magicman54494
500 Club
Posts: 3192
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: central and northern WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby magicman54494 » Thu May 25, 2017 2:07 pm

Singing Bridge wrote:Crazy busy with work and kids... but this is one podcast I will get to no matter what. There is no hunter I respect more than Todd.

Thanks Scott, that means a lot to me coming from a hunter of your caliber. respect back at you!
Stay thirsty my friend



Deflating lungs since 1975
User avatar
stash59
500 Club
Posts: 4979
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:22 am
Location: S Central Wi.
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby stash59 » Thu May 25, 2017 4:22 pm

magicman54494 wrote:
stash59 wrote:Todd thanx ever so much for taking the time to do this. Gonna have to listen to this multiple times.

You are welcome


stash59 wrote: Do you have a certain circuit you plan on covering in the truck each day to look for tracks for each state? Or do you just kinda go where your gut tells you or even on a whim. How long is it? How often do you get out of the truck and just walk to find a fresh track?


It varies. There are days that I drive all day and never find a good track. I tend to go to places where I have history on certain bucks. I will get out and walk to spots that I know a buck is using to see if he came thru. Sometimes if I can't find a good track I will follow a lesser buck to see if he leads me to a better one. this happens a lot. I switch tracks whenever I find a better one. I usually don't follow lesser bucks but if I haven't been on a good one for a few days I like to stretch my legs.

stash59 wrote:How big are the chunks of ground without roads you'll hunt? Or do you base it more on the area being desolate despite a road or even a highway going through it.


I tend to hunt the biggest blocks because I don't like running into private land most of it is national forest. many miles in each direction. I do hunt some edges of private especially if I know a good buck is bedding there. I will check to see if he came in or out. I will take a chance if private is near and the buck is real big. If he goes on the private that's just the way the ball bounces sometimes.

stash59 wrote:Do you take into account the stride width of a buck? If so what's a good bucks stride width? And as long as I'm talking numbers. Do you have any for stride lengths that make you stop and take notice? I know you said that it varies depending on how fresh or tired the buck is. How much can it vary?


I measure it. two boots long is a nice walking stride. You will have to measure my boots to get an exact number. size 10 alphas. I don't really much care how long the stride is. if the track is big I take it. Stride width is not very exact. I've seen big bucks with narrow width and small bucks with wide width. I really haven't noticed a width change when they are tired but what you will see is arcing drag marks. What I do see when they are tired is they lay back on their dews a lot more and when they are fresh they stand more on their toes.

stash59 wrote:Do you see the same exact circuits being run by different bucks over a period of years? Or are the truly large tracked bucks so rare that you don't find them in the same places. Or are they so individual in where they choose to roam that only major terrain features like the river crossings you mentioned the only common travel areas.


There are crossings that are used by multiple bucks. These are spots where they almost need to cross there to get from one area to another. Each buck seems to define his own area and how he travels it.

stash59 wrote:With security being their primary concern. Do you still kinda see the bucks taking the path of least resistance whenever possible? If so do you use this to cyber scout for new areas? What really jumps out at you on a aerial or topo to make you consider it may hold mature bucks to hunt?


Old buck will take the SAFEST path of least resistance. They mainly travel at night and will often walk right down the logging roads. Most areas will hold one good buck if there is cover and feed. One area I hunt right now holds a good one every 2 -3 square miles. There is so much land that it is real hard to look at a map and say a big one will be here. I just assume there is a good one there somewhere and check the EDGES.

stash59 wrote:You got time to write a book?

I think you just made me. lol


That's kinda why I asked!!! But serious about the book. "Tracking Mature Bucks with Todd Havel" just has a nice ring to it!!! Don't ya think? Sounds like you got tons of cool photos to go with it!!!!:mrgreen:

Thanx again for all of the info. And all the time it took on your part to put it all together.

Your explaination on the tired strides kicked in a memory of some all day horse rides. By the end of the day the horses weren't picking their feet as high but swinging them out a little more. And when I think about it they too were laying back more on the rear part of their hooves.

And my size 10 Muck boots measure 24" at 2 boots long. Can't be too much different. Are you measuring from toe to toe, same as heel to heel or toe to heel?

Also not mentioned is how you have your truck set up. 4x4 I assume. A winch? Chainsaw in the back always? Tire chains? Shovel? Tow rope? Pull behind or slide in camper?

Despite my physical limitations you've got me thinking about a way to still try tracking. Not be as picky on track size, so take even 3 finger or .308 shell size tracks. Use the aerials to make sure I'm not heading into too tough of terrain right off the bat. Follow till I get tired, rest, then head back to the truck. You've killed just enough of them pretty quick that even these lower odds would be worth it to me. It just sounds too fun to pass up. Now all I gotta do is talk someone to go with me. Up to my old stomping grounds. Someone young with a strong back for pulling big deer out!!! Any of you 20 somethings reading this?

Again "big" thanx

Chuck
Happiness is a large gutpile!!!!!!!
User avatar
magicman54494
500 Club
Posts: 3192
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: central and northern WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby magicman54494 » Thu May 25, 2017 6:32 pm

stash,
i have a 4x4 truck. nothing special. i dont drive in places that i could get stuck. i do go down some overgrown log roads that scratch it up a bit but thats about it. if its risky to drive i usually choose to walk. i carry a bow saw because i run into a lot af downed trees. no winch. no chains. i sometimes bring my atv but less and less as time goes on. i have a pull behind camper. 24" seems about right for a good buck stride.
no thought of writing a book at this time, life is just too busy with other plans. maybe when i get old. lol
Stay thirsty my friend



Deflating lungs since 1975
User avatar
Dewey
Moderator
Posts: 19835
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:57 pm
Location: Wisconsin
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby Dewey » Thu May 25, 2017 7:43 pm

Magic you mentioned some days you don't find a buck to track. That has been one of my biggest challenges starting out. I try driving roads early morning checking fresh tracks but in very low deer density areas that can be very difficult. I'm working on getting better at that but lack of deer much less mature bucks is kinda like the needle in the haystack thing. I find I do better by just walking into remote areas I know has held good bucks in the past and and searching on foot till I run across a good track. Some of these large tracts of land I rarely see mature buck tracks cross the main roads. Walking logging roads basically speed tracking till I find a good one has produced fairly well for me.

Wondering how often driving around you get an actual visual of a buck and then jump out and track him down? Have you ever been succesful doing that?

I have tracked down a number of nice bucks in the last 3 years but still haven't fired a shot. You mentioned paying too much attention to the tracks and not being aware of your surroundings.......that hit home with me because I have been guilty of that. Missed a few shot opportunities because of this. :doh: I don't look a those as failures but instead as great learning experiences.

I truly love snow tracking. I have thought about giving up gun hunting for a number of years but this has brought the fun back into the hunt for me. I would like to thank you Magic because you are directly responsible for that. 8-)

Like you mentioned instead of sitting, waiting and hoping for a buck to come past a treestand when tracking I KNOW a good buck is ahead of me. Nothing is more exciting than that and the fun lasts all day. My only regret is I waited till so late in my life to do this. Never too old to teach an old dog new tricks. ;)
User avatar
Edcyclopedia
Posts: 9035
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:54 pm
Location: S. NH
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby Edcyclopedia » Fri May 26, 2017 12:07 am

magicman54494 wrote:
Singing Bridge wrote:Crazy busy with work and kids... but this is one podcast I will get to no matter what. There is no hunter I respect more than Todd.

Thanks Scott, that means a lot to me coming from a hunter of your caliber. respect back at you!


Reciprocal Man-Crushes...
Xoxo
Expect the Unexpected when you least Expect it...

How did Obummer ever make it to office...?
Image
User avatar
magicman54494
500 Club
Posts: 3192
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: central and northern WI
Status: Offline

Re: Episode #12 - Tracking Whitetails with Todd Havel

Postby magicman54494 » Fri May 26, 2017 1:49 am

Dewey wrote:
Wondering how often driving around you get an actual visual of a buck and then jump out and track him down? Have you ever been succesful doing that?

in years prior to tracking i saw some dandies crossin front of me. when i started tracking i thought it would be cool if i could see one cross then go get him. i havent seen a good one from the road since then . lol
i have seen a bunch of young ones but nothing big. mature buck numbers have really fallen over the last 10 years. its getting harder and harder to find older bucks.
Stay thirsty my friend



Deflating lungs since 1975

Return to “Podcast”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest