Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby muddy » Sat May 20, 2017 2:06 pm

Maybe I'm mistaken, but the bird's left side was facing the blind on the first shot, and he showed the right wing in the last 10 seconds of video? Regardless of my thoughts on expandables on turkeys (only way to go) a dead bird is all that matters.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby stash59 » Sat May 20, 2017 2:47 pm

Yeah I'm confused! He shot at the left side on the first shot but it's the birds right side shown on the tailgate.

I've never shot expandables myself. Know guys that have or still do. Plus I've done quite abit of research. They work best with a fairly heavy arrow shot out of a pretty heavy draw bow. So even on a turkey with it's thin skin. A lighter arrow and draw weight bow they won't work well. Meaning they won't open.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dan » Sat May 20, 2017 3:16 pm

muddy wrote:Maybe I'm mistaken, but the bird's left side was facing the blind on the first shot, and he showed the right wing in the last 10 seconds of video? Regardless of my thoughts on expandables on turkeys (only way to go) a dead bird is all that matters.

Hmmm didn't notice that till you pointed it out. I will ask him about that. He said he hit the bird in the wingbutt but I can't see the exact hit on the footage, I do know part of the beard was laying next to where he took the 1st shot and you can see the arrow hit dirt under the bird like a deflection...
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dirt nap giver » Sat May 20, 2017 11:06 pm

Each brand of broadhead flys diffently hence the need for tuning with the head on.
I don't know if muzzy has the same point of impact as a Rage, but personal experience has shown me that shooting 2 different heads won't have the same flight path.

Congrats to Dave for getting it done with a bow.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby Kokes » Sat May 20, 2017 11:09 pm

Great video Dan thanks for sharing, crazy the bird came back but goes to show you never know what will happen next...

I think when I try killing turkeys with a bow I will use the magnus broadheads that you aim for the head to decapitate the bird....figure you hit and it's a dead bird...you miss and it walks away..
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby muddy » Sun May 21, 2017 1:01 am

dan wrote:
muddy wrote:Maybe I'm mistaken, but the bird's left side was facing the blind on the first shot, and he showed the right wing in the last 10 seconds of video? Regardless of my thoughts on expandables on turkeys (only way to go) a dead bird is all that matters.

Hmmm didn't notice that till you pointed it out. I will ask him about that. He said he hit the bird in the wingbutt but I can't see the exact hit on the footage, I do know part of the beard was laying next to where he took the 1st shot and you can see the arrow hit dirt under the bird like a deflection...


I'll bet you a 12 pack of Spotted Cow that the bird turned slightly towards him at release and he skipped off the FRONT of the bird (hence beard on the ground) and then clipped the off side wing joint. The video made it seem like that to me at least, but like you, I couldn't see point of impact either. I was blowm away by his jean shorts and calf high white tube socks tho!!
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby Stanley » Sun May 21, 2017 1:29 am

Good stuff. I think anyone that has used bow & arrow on turkeys has had some sour hits. Hit them good you get them hit them a little sour you don't, no matter what head you use. :think:
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dan » Sun May 21, 2017 12:01 pm

dirt nap giver wrote:Each brand of broadhead flys diffently hence the need for tuning with the head on.
I don't know if muzzy has the same point of impact as a Rage, but personal experience has shown me that shooting 2 different heads won't have the same flight path.

Congrats to Dave for getting it done with a bow.

Yea... Your on to something there. He said he did not sight in the rage cause of the cost, and cause the sales guy said "shoots like a target tip"... As far as I go, Im with Muddy in that an expandable is a fine choice for turkeys. (Im not on board with deer tho) My title was more to attract views and maybe some conversation.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dan » Sun May 21, 2017 12:04 pm

muddy wrote:
dan wrote:
muddy wrote:Maybe I'm mistaken, but the bird's left side was facing the blind on the first shot, and he showed the right wing in the last 10 seconds of video? Regardless of my thoughts on expandables on turkeys (only way to go) a dead bird is all that matters.

Hmmm didn't notice that till you pointed it out. I will ask him about that. He said he hit the bird in the wingbutt but I can't see the exact hit on the footage, I do know part of the beard was laying next to where he took the 1st shot and you can see the arrow hit dirt under the bird like a deflection...


I'll bet you a 12 pack of Spotted Cow that the bird turned slightly towards him at release and he skipped off the FRONT of the bird (hence beard on the ground) and then clipped the off side wing joint. The video made it seem like that to me at least, but like you, I couldn't see point of impact either. I was blowm away by his jean shorts and calf high white tube socks tho!!

Your theory makes sense to me... I also liked the choice of hunting clothes. Made me chuckle.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dan » Sun May 21, 2017 12:05 pm

Stanley wrote:Good stuff. I think anyone that has used bow & arrow on turkeys has had some sour hits. Hit them good you get them hit them a little sour you don't, no matter what head you use. :think:

Agreed.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby gjs4 » Mon May 22, 2017 2:31 am

To each there own is my advisor premise here.

Got my first Tom intentionally archery hunting it last year (blind, dekes, calling)... not the walking by during deer season variety. Had a fixed blade head (Easton xt) and hit him perfect in my opinion. Had my son with me who actually sugggested I bowhunt as he knows I'm a gun guy but not a gun hunter. If memory serves me right it was 23 yards. He flew up in the air and down into the adjacent ravine 50 yard away. Kid runs out as I told him we need to wait. See the bird sitting in the creek at the bottom w blood coming out of him and down the stream. Heartbreaking to both of us. Grabbed him, tried to choke him dead but settled for a swift whack from a stick.

I, personally, won't bowhunt turkeys again unless I tried a decapation arrow setup (and don't like the idea). Ethically and morally I can not rest seeing animals fade any less than fast as possible. Shotguns do a wonderful job. Obviously have had less than desirable deer -arrow events but that turkey has stuck with me.

Guess my point it- I don't see them flopping over dead from body broad head shots.

Again- not trying to impose my beliefs, degrade others or say anything was wrong in the video...and heck I'm only an advocate of turkeys as tablefare....just throwing my two cents in the ring.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby mauser06 » Mon May 22, 2017 3:10 am

Interesting video... anyone able to doctor it and show the first arrow???



After shooting 2 with the bow I swore I'd never do it again...both were wild turkey chases. I recovered both. But it wasn't easy. One died after a 100-125yd flight. The other I chased around a corn field picking up dirty arrows to re-shoot. It was a mess.

Swore I was done.


I studied up turkey anatomy and archery shot placement. The wing but is THE place to hit. They can't fly...and it takes out the vitals..and with a big enough head it aughta hit the spine. It's lights out.


Last fall a big gobbler came by the stand and I aimed higher and more forward than usual. The sucker fell onto his back and wiggled his toes a few times and it was over. So fast that a dozen longbeards and 30 some hens/young of the year passed by within 20yds and never batted an eye.

I couldn't believe it. That was with a 1 1/4" 4 blade that blew right through him.


Prior, I'd shoot for what I thought was the wing but... basically center of the body.


There's a saying..."shoot em low and watch them go...shoot em high and watch them die". IMO it holds true. That spot is small and higher and more forward than you'd think...

If I bought dedicated turkey heads, and I might, it's going to be a 3" 3 blade jack knife mechanical. That 3" cut will give a good margin of error...and the 3" jack knife aughta hit light a freight train..


That's my experience and thoughts....


A bad hit and they can be a nightmare...little to no blood...and they are known to hide themselves very well...
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby dan » Mon May 22, 2017 9:56 am

gjs4 wrote:To each there own is my advisor premise here.

Got my first Tom intentionally archery hunting it last year (blind, dekes, calling)... not the walking by during deer season variety. Had a fixed blade head (Easton xt) and hit him perfect in my opinion. Had my son with me who actually sugggested I bowhunt as he knows I'm a gun guy but not a gun hunter. If memory serves me right it was 23 yards. He flew up in the air and down into the adjacent ravine 50 yard away. Kid runs out as I told him we need to wait. See the bird sitting in the creek at the bottom w blood coming out of him and down the stream. Heartbreaking to both of us. Grabbed him, tried to choke him dead but settled for a swift whack from a stick.

I, personally, won't bowhunt turkeys again unless I tried a decapation arrow setup (and don't like the idea). Ethically and morally I can not rest seeing animals fade any less than fast as possible. Shotguns do a wonderful job. Obviously have had less than desirable deer -arrow events but that turkey has stuck with me.

Guess my point it- I don't see them flopping over dead from body broad head shots.

Again- not trying to impose my beliefs, degrade others or say anything was wrong in the video...and heck I'm only an advocate of turkeys as tablefare....just throwing my two cents in the ring.

I have only bowhunted for turkeys a few times... I prefer shotgun and run and gun... BUT... Not for the same reasons as you. You see, I have seen a lot of birds that people called "missed" with shotgun that really were hit. Take the 1st bird I shot in the extreme turkey tactics video I released. I shot it 5 times at close range, you can hear the shot hit the bird each shot, but it did not drop, it flew off and died elsewhere. I have found scarred over wounds in birds I or friends killed too proving guns wound too... I have also found dead birds not found by the hunter cause even shotgun birds can fly away and die elswhere or suffer... And as far as decapitation? I know guys who shoot that way that have had plenty of hits that just nick the neck, or don't break the neck, or accidentally hit the body.. Its a lot like deer hunting, a lot of guys who don't deer hunt won't allow bow hunting cause they are under the mis-understanding that bows wound more than guns. Which, I really do not believe to be true. Just my 2 cents.
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Re: Rage vs Muzzy - 2 arrows, 1 bird

Unread postby mauser06 » Mon May 22, 2017 12:03 pm

I agree Dan...a big reason bow hunters get a black eye is because the rifle season is after archery season and they find someones lost deer...after rifle season, the woods, at least in Pennsylvania, are pretty much empty. No one out there to find the rifle hunters deer.


I agree about shotguns and turkeys. I lost one I know I clobbered. How it didn't drop and flop is still beyond me. I looked for hours knowing he was dead..I just had to find him. I didn't. It was a vertical hillside and covered in downed trees and boulders and the like. He likely buried himself under something and I just couldn't find it.


Last year, the first bird I ever shot with my flintlock was a fiasco. I shot him and he staggered but did the turkey trot. Kept going. There I am with a Flintlock and no reload. Figured if I missed, I would go to the truck and reload. Didn't think I'd get or need a follow up.

I chased him across the field and after 120yds or so I caught up. He turned around and ran right at me. Blood leaking from one of his eyes. He was within a few feet. Continued to Chase and he took flight. I was loosing sight of him but it looked like he was going down. I kept running. There is a tree line/ditch, a road and then woods across the road. I had no idea where or if he landed. I started a grid at the tree line...when I was in the ditch I could SMELL turkey. I knew he was in the high weeds there somewhere. I found him next to a cherry tree. Took a bit..but I won the battle.


After that I developed other loads for my flintlock that are more powerful and pattern better. This year's bird dropped straight to the ground and was lights out.

They are tough critters. If that spine or brain doesn't take some pellets, they may soak it up and run or fly off. I agree there is probably a fair percentage of "misses" that are actually dead birds that hunters don't even look for. Same with some rifle hunters. Not uncommon for a handful of them to shoot a deer and not follow up because they didn't see it drop.


I witnessed that one day. Opening day...I'm still not sure what happened. 2 small buck came by. The ridge was lined with hunters. One maybe 100-125yds away. Neither were legal for adults to shoot. They get to the other hunters and POW. They both ran back. One hit fairly well...leaking blood enough that I could see. I can't legally shoot it. I watched it leave my view. Waited till dark and they never trailed it. I tried to catch them walking out but when they got down I lost them because about lunch time it was a parade of hunters leaving. I don't know if anyone ever went and looked for him or not. Didn't seem like it though. Not sure if they assumed the youth hunter missed or if they realized it was an illegal buck after it ran off or what...


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