B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Brian1986 » Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:57 am

I don't have a problem with B&C making a statement about what they define as fair chase. Technology is only going to continue to improve. I don't have a problem if a western state agrees with B&C and aligns their state regs with that definition. If the folks in that state have an issue, they'll be able to address it with their DNR. I don't personally care what another guy does when he hunts. I hunt in the way that matters to me. But,,,

I think there are bigger picture issues in play personally. Every year out west you hear about attacks on hunting rights. Several states this year have bills proposed to ban all predator hunting. British Columbia already banned Grizzly hunting a few years ago. The slippery slope is getting more slippery. After reading through this thread, we as informed hunters who love the animals we pursue, have strong opinions on both sides of the cell cam topic. Even we are questioning whether they're too effective (because of how we perceive them to work, even if they may/may not be the advantage they might seem to be). But think of how the non-hunting public must perceive cell cameras and smart scopes (also in the article), not to mention the anti's? Especially when the cell camera is used like it has been at those water holes. It can't be positive. I think we should take that into account. The tech is only going to get better as years go by. So, I don't think it's a bad thing that B&C made a statement about where they as a club draw the line.


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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby <DK> » Sat Jan 15, 2022 3:02 am

dan wrote:Keep in mind in order to learn about all this failure, you have to be a good enough hunter to scout and understand what your looking at and find these situations to even put a camera there... In other words, it takes skill to kill a deer using a trail cam... Again, its main function is to tell you the deer exists in the area so you can have goals, dreams, and motivation... Look at all my bucks, and 1 was shot cause of camera info, and it was not a cell cam, despite me usually having one or 2 cams running. Other than that, for me I learn so much about deer behavior that its a great teacher for me...


I definitely agree with you about this Dan. They have helped me develop instincts to be better without them.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby tim » Sat Jan 15, 2022 4:36 am

James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.

That’s pretty interesting now playing devils advocate…..what if the search for that deer wasn’t called off due to the hunter but a property owner not allowing the retrieval of said deer and later the owner finds the deer and gives it to the hunter . I’ve heard people say neighboring landowners don’t want there land blown out because they are hunting it or whatever the case. Is that the same situation ? Full disclosure I have no deer in the books I’m just curious due to the strong response of the topic a while back on deer recovery from public to private or neighboring farms near property lines ….
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby <DK> » Sat Jan 15, 2022 6:21 am

tim wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.

That’s pretty interesting now playing devils advocate…..what if the search for that deer wasn’t called off due to the hunter but a property owner not allowing the retrieval of said deer and later the owner finds the deer and gives it to the hunter . I’ve heard people say neighboring landowners don’t want there land blown out because they are hunting it or whatever the case. Is that the same situation ? Full disclosure I have no deer in the books I’m just curious due to the strong response of the topic a while back on deer recovery from public to private or neighboring farms near property lines ….


I believe that is why they would have the person do a full write up of the recovery circumstances.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby dan » Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:01 am

tim wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.

That’s pretty interesting now playing devils advocate…..what if the search for that deer wasn’t called off due to the hunter but a property owner not allowing the retrieval of said deer and later the owner finds the deer and gives it to the hunter . I’ve heard people say neighboring landowners don’t want there land blown out because they are hunting it or whatever the case. Is that the same situation ? Full disclosure I have no deer in the books I’m just curious due to the strong response of the topic a while back on deer recovery from public to private or neighboring farms near property lines ….

What about the Jordon buck? The rack was lost by a taxidermist and decades later without much proof Jorden claimed it as his lost rack... Was it? Im not sure.
Jim Jordan was hunting with his friend Egus Davis in Danbury, Wisconsin on November 20, 1914. A recent snowfall allowed the men to follow a fresh set of tracks, which ultimately led to the world-record buck. Jim shot the buck with his .25-20 Winchester rifle and later recovered the deer in the middle of the Yellow River. A bizarre chain of events followed the buck after it was left in the hands of local taxidermist, George VanCastle. After several months of waiting to get the mount back, Jim travelled to George’s house in Hinckley, Minnesota only to find out he had moved. However, unbeknownst to Jim, the mount was still in the attic of George’s house.[2] In 1958, the original Jordan Buck mount showed up at a rummage sale in Sandstone, Minnesota. They were purchased by Bob Ludwig.[3] In 1971, the Jordan Buck was sent to Pennsylvania to be officially scored by a Boone & Crockett judges’ panel. The deer was declared a new world record with a final net typical score of 206 1/8 points.[1] It wasn't until 1978 that James Jordan was finally declared the hunter and Danbury, Wisconsin as the location of the kill. Unfortunately, James Jordan died two months prior to the decision by the Boone & Crockett Club.[4]

The Jordan Buck was the world record typical white-tailed deer for close to 80 years. It was eclipsed for the top world spot in 1993 by a buck taken by Milo Hanson in Saskatchewan. After 100 years, the Jordan Buck remains the highest-scoring typical whitetail ever taken in the United States.[5] The Jordan Buck is one of the most famous bucks in the world due to its enormous set of antlers and bizarre history. The Jordan Buck was part of the original Legendary Whitetails collection owned by Larry Huffman.[6] The original set of antlers were purchased with Huffman's entire collection of Legendary Whitetails by Bass Pro Shops in 2002. The mount now hangs with the King of Bucks Collection in the American National Fish and Wildlife Museum in Springfield, Missouri.[7] Replica mounts of the Jordan Buck exist in several locations throughout the country, including Crex Meadows State Wildlife Area, Legendary Whitetails, Cabela’s and Bass Pro Shops.[2]
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Brad » Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:31 am

dan wrote:
Brad wrote:I have a question for the guys who have consistently and successfully killed mature bucks.
I don't want anyone to take it the wrong way, because it is NOT in any way intended to take anything away from anybody's success. I'm sure there are some who wish not to answer the question honestly, and that's ok. If you think the question is out of line, let me know, as I am always open to constructive criticism.

How many of the mature bucks or trophy bucks that you have you've killed were killed with any type of assistance of trail cameras, including even minimal use of cameras or indirect assistance killing a buck because of cameras?

I'd love to hear what you all have to say about this, and again, it is for information, not to take anything away. I have only been hunting 3 seasons, so I understand that I don't know half as much as most of you guys on here. That said, I believe I have been fairly pretty successful for being at it such a short time, and I have never once used a trail camera. I have been considering trying to use one or a few, but I am torn about it.

My last buck I shot last September... I 1st saw it about 4 years ago. Then I put out a camera. Got a few pictures a year of it. I used a cell cams cause it was so remote. and they did tell me when the deer was out there, vut always exactly when he was out there... "to late" info... Cause he rarely did the same thing 2 days in a row. I shot him a long ways from where I usually ran the camera. The main thing the camera did for me was help me understand how that buck and all bucks in that area used the wind, what time of day and night they traveled, which direction they tended to travel, and that the buck I was after still existed. The only real thing the camera did to help me kill the deer was to keep me motivated, and make me want to be out there hunting.

The buck I got the year before was on Daves farm where I iften ran cameras, but generally not cell cams, I like cell cams on public cause when they get stole I see it get stole and can beat the thief to the parking lot. Anywho, I got one picture of the buck I shot 2 years ago at Daves. However I did not see the picture till after I shot the buck. The camera helped me understand timing and movement in one area of the farm. I learned from the pic of that buck, but it in no way helped me kill it... Matter of fact, I often think about how much putting those cameras out hurts my success, its a balancing act... Getting intel vs getting your scent out there in spots that tip off the deer, I would also say the cameras themselves spook a lot of deer, and I personally believe cameras cost more deer than they get for the average hunter...

I use cameras every year, but the only deer I recall off hand that I ever got from using a trail camera was at the D'Aquisto petting zoo... He had cameras every where and I checked one on a food plot and saw a nice buck was on the cam 3 out of the last 5 days in daylight and set right up figuring if he came in he would smell my scent and leave. So same day hunt as the cam check and he showed up and I shot him. It was a just off wind and I pushed it and the buck was spooky when I shot it. It was no gimmy...

For the most part cameras tell me a deer exists... They don't shoot it for me, they don't give me the perceived huge advantage, often they hurt more than they help... For example, I thought putting a cell cam over a buck bed would be a n easy way to kill the buck, maybe to easy, but... Actually try it sometime. LOL. Bucks shift beds a lot and move often and beds are set up so you have a hard time getting close, and bucks do not like intrusion on there bedding areas and notice a camera hanging there... You ruin a pretty good bedding area pretty quick putting a camera over a bed... I have found you can sometimes get away with a camera on the exit trail of a bedding area if its hidden well and placed far in advance of when you expect the buck to bed there... Because deer enter beds from different directions based on wind and therms, getting them going in to bed is very difficult. Add the fact that most buck bedding areas have 20 or more beds, and you gotta have luck to capture him in the exact bed you want... Keep in mind in order to learn about all this failure, you have to be a good enough hunter to scout and understand what your looking at and find these situations to even put a camera there... In other words, it takes skill to kill a deer using a trail cam... Again, its main function is to tell you the deer exists in the area so you can have goals, dreams, and motivation... Look at all my bucks, and 1 was shot cause of camera info, and it was not a cell cam, despite me usually having one or 2 cams running. Other than that, for me I learn so much about deer behavior that its a great teacher for me...


Dan, your answer to my question confirms something I already thought... you're awesome. Thank you. I really appreciate your answer and your honesty. I can absolutely see your points on camera use often hurting most peoples chance at success. and especially if putting them up or checking them too close to when you hunt it or if checking them too often.

As I said. I have never once used a trail camera of any kind. I am not against anyone using them, and nobody has to justify their use to me by any means. Many times I have considered using them myself. Here in MO it is against the rules to use cameras on state land, but many people do it anyway, which honestly doesn't bother me a bit. The spot I'm considering using them is city managed land that does not have the rule against their use. I was thinking about getting one or two just to get inventory in the area because on Nov 3rd this year I killed the stud that I believe was the monarch buck in the spot. Now I want to see if other big bucks move in or if the young ones there grow into studs and stick around. My thought was to put them up mid to late summer. let them soak till mid season during the rut, switch cards when in for a hunt, then take them out after the end of the season, simply to get any intel for the following season.

I am not anti-camera, I've just never used them. I have never spoken to a consistent buck killer that doesn't use them, and never have spoken to anyone who has targeted a specific buck without using cameras. For me it's definitely not about being a step behind other hunters, because I couldn't care less about how I compare to others. I do feel like it may help me to be more efficient in hunting the areas I use cameras. The spot I want to use them is an hour and a half away from my house, and I have a wife & 3 kids, 2 of which are young kids in the home. I'd like to make sure they still like me and continue to tolerate my obsession with hunting.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Brad » Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:56 am

James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.




That's a very interesting story. I feel bad for that kid too. Maybe you know the answer to this, but it brings up a question regarding my situation this year. My buck was not a B&C caliber deer, but surpassed P&Y (144 3/8" per my taxidermist). I shot the buck around 5:20 pm on Nov 3rd, then went back with a tracker the next day. We ended up bumping the buck (obviously still alive) about 24 hours after the shot. I went back to the location to "hunt", mainly to see if I could get eyes on the same buck... & not surprising to me I didn't see one deer that day in the stand. I got down and decided to get downwind of where I thought this buck bedded, then get aggressive and work my way into the bedding area, just to see if he was around and still alive for closure and later hunting intel. I got to a creek drainage and saw a vulture fly up from behind some brush further down the creek... I knew I had to go look, and found my buck there around 11 am on Nov 6th. If he were a B&C caliber deer, would he be allowed in the books in that situation?

I don't think there is a great deal of distaste for B&C or P&Y. For me it's more of an indifference. I have no desire to get my name in a book. I have only the one buck that would be eligible for P&Y (unless the above story disqualifies mine... ). I hunt only for me. I have no desire for any notoriety, no desire for my name being in a book, and no desire to impress anyone else. Pretty soon I will have my second shoulder mount on my wall, and honestly nobody gives a crap about those deer, or those mounts, but me. I feel the same about my name being in a book. Nobody but me would care, and my name being in a book doesn't make me feel anything either. When I look at the buck (soon to be bucks!) on my wall I remember the rollercoaster of emotions, the time, the effort, the sacrifice, and everything else that came with that experience... it means alot. Others may come in my house and say "that's a nice buck", but that's as much as it means to them. A name in a book, to me seems worthless. But that's just for me, and I think it's absolutely awesome for you if that means something to you. Anyone who has any distaste for B&C or P&Y I feel like it's due to a specific bad experience, such as a couple of stories mentioned in this thread.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby James » Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:48 am

Brad wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.




That's a very interesting story. I feel bad for that kid too. Maybe you know the answer to this, but it brings up a question regarding my situation this year. My buck was not a B&C caliber deer, but surpassed P&Y (144 3/8" per my taxidermist). I shot the buck around 5:20 pm on Nov 3rd, then went back with a tracker the next day. We ended up bumping the buck (obviously still alive) about 24 hours after the shot. I went back to the location to "hunt", mainly to see if I could get eyes on the same buck... & not surprising to me I didn't see one deer that day in the stand. I got down and decided to get downwind of where I thought this buck bedded, then get aggressive and work my way into the bedding area, just to see if he was around and still alive for closure and later hunting intel. I got to a creek drainage and saw a vulture fly up from behind some brush further down the creek... I knew I had to go look, and found my buck there around 11 am on Nov 6th. If he were a B&C caliber deer, would he be allowed in the books in that situation?

I don't think there is a great deal of distaste for B&C or P&Y. For me it's more of an indifference. I have no desire to get my name in a book. I have only the one buck that would be eligible for P&Y (unless the above story disqualifies mine... ). I hunt only for me. I have no desire for any notoriety, no desire for my name being in a book, and no desire to impress anyone else. Pretty soon I will have my second shoulder mount on my wall, and honestly nobody gives a crap about those deer, or those mounts, but me. I feel the same about my name being in a book. Nobody but me would care, and my name being in a book doesn't make me feel anything either. When I look at the buck (soon to be bucks!) on my wall I remember the rollercoaster of emotions, the time, the effort, the sacrifice, and everything else that came with that experience... it means alot. Others may come in my house and say "that's a nice buck", but that's as much as it means to them. A name in a book, to me seems worthless. But that's just for me, and I think it's absolutely awesome for you if that means something to you. Anyone who has any distaste for B&C or P&Y I feel like it's due to a specific bad experience, such as a couple of stories mentioned in this thread.


It sounded to me like you did everything you could to recover that animal and that is the intent of what P&Y is after with their rulings. From their position statement "It is the responsibility of all hunters to give total effort to recover an animal by track and trail until every reasonable possibility has been exhausted." I assume you wrapped your buck tag on him and called it good for the season with that tag/buck? If it were me I would say I would allow that. The hunt in between gets a little dangerous though. Had a beautiful 180" buck walked by would you have just let him go? Your statement sounds to me like you did it in pursuit of the one you shot (aka still trying to recover him)

There was a moose that was killed by a bowhunter not too many years ago. The hunter and outfitter watched the double lunged moose swim into the middle of a lake and to the shock of both hunter and outfitter, he sank (they normally float). The next morning when they went to recover him, the lake had frozen over. The hunter came back the next spring and had arranged for the carcass to be retrieved from the lake. In talking with a club member there was a lot of discussion on this one, but they allowed the animal in as the hunter ended his hunting and made every effort he could to retrieve the animal! Incredible.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby James » Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:50 am

<DK> wrote:
tim wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.

That’s pretty interesting now playing devils advocate…..what if the search for that deer wasn’t called off due to the hunter but a property owner not allowing the retrieval of said deer and later the owner finds the deer and gives it to the hunter . I’ve heard people say neighboring landowners don’t want there land blown out because they are hunting it or whatever the case. Is that the same situation ? Full disclosure I have no deer in the books I’m just curious due to the strong response of the topic a while back on deer recovery from public to private or neighboring farms near property lines ….


I believe that is why they would have the person do a full write up of the recovery circumstances.


Yes exactly. I can't imagine a measurer who would not allow that. You did everything you could and up to the point where it would have required breaking the law (trespassing).
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby James » Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:58 am

dan wrote:
tim wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.

That’s pretty interesting now playing devils advocate…..what if the search for that deer wasn’t called off due to the hunter but a property owner not allowing the retrieval of said deer and later the owner finds the deer and gives it to the hunter . I’ve heard people say neighboring landowners don’t want there land blown out because they are hunting it or whatever the case. Is that the same situation ? Full disclosure I have no deer in the books I’m just curious due to the strong response of the topic a while back on deer recovery from public to private or neighboring farms near property lines ….

What about the Jordon buck? The rack was lost by a taxidermist and decades later without much proof Jorden claimed it as his lost rack... Was it? Im not sure.
Jim Jordan was hunting with his friend Egus Davis in Danbury, Wisconsin on November 20, 1914. A recent snowfall allowed the men to follow a fresh set of tracks, which ultimately led to the world-record buck. Jim shot the buck with his .25-20 Winchester rifle and later recovered the deer in the middle of the Yellow River. A bizarre chain of events followed the buck after it was left in the hands of local taxidermist, George VanCastle. After several months of waiting to get the mount back, Jim travelled to George’s house in Hinckley, Minnesota only to find out he had moved. However, unbeknownst to Jim, the mount was still in the attic of George’s house.[2] In 1958, the original Jordan Buck mount showed up at a rummage sale in Sandstone, Minnesota. They were purchased by Bob Ludwig.[3] In 1971, the Jordan Buck was sent to Pennsylvania to be officially scored by a Boone & Crockett judges’ panel. The deer was declared a new world record with a final net typical score of 206 1/8 points.[1] It wasn't until 1978 that James Jordan was finally declared the hunter and Danbury, Wisconsin as the location of the kill. Unfortunately, James Jordan died two months prior to the decision by the Boone & Crockett Club.[4]

The Jordan Buck was the world record typical white-tailed deer for close to 80 years. It was eclipsed for the top world spot in 1993 by a buck taken by Milo Hanson in Saskatchewan. After 100 years, the Jordan Buck remains the highest-scoring typical whitetail ever taken in the United States.[5] The Jordan Buck is one of the most famous bucks in the world due to its enormous set of antlers and bizarre history. The Jordan Buck was part of the original Legendary Whitetails collection owned by Larry Huffman.[6] The original set of antlers were purchased with Huffman's entire collection of Legendary Whitetails by Bass Pro Shops in 2002. The mount now hangs with the King of Bucks Collection in the American National Fish and Wildlife Museum in Springfield, Missouri.[7] Replica mounts of the Jordan Buck exist in several locations throughout the country, including Crex Meadows State Wildlife Area, Legendary Whitetails, Cabela’s and Bass Pro Shops.[2]


Yeah, it sounded like it took years to convince B&C that it was indeed his. Several people came forward and there was some "evidence". I haven't seen any concrete examples of what that evidence was but they obviously made the call that it was indeed his.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Brad » Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:36 pm

James wrote:
Brad wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.




That's a very interesting story. I feel bad for that kid too. Maybe you know the answer to this, but it brings up a question regarding my situation this year. My buck was not a B&C caliber deer, but surpassed P&Y (144 3/8" per my taxidermist). I shot the buck around 5:20 pm on Nov 3rd, then went back with a tracker the next day. We ended up bumping the buck (obviously still alive) about 24 hours after the shot. I went back to the location to "hunt", mainly to see if I could get eyes on the same buck... & not surprising to me I didn't see one deer that day in the stand. I got down and decided to get downwind of where I thought this buck bedded, then get aggressive and work my way into the bedding area, just to see if he was around and still alive for closure and later hunting intel. I got to a creek drainage and saw a vulture fly up from behind some brush further down the creek... I knew I had to go look, and found my buck there around 11 am on Nov 6th. If he were a B&C caliber deer, would he be allowed in the books in that situation?

I don't think there is a great deal of distaste for B&C or P&Y. For me it's more of an indifference. I have no desire to get my name in a book. I have only the one buck that would be eligible for P&Y (unless the above story disqualifies mine... ). I hunt only for me. I have no desire for any notoriety, no desire for my name being in a book, and no desire to impress anyone else. Pretty soon I will have my second shoulder mount on my wall, and honestly nobody gives a crap about those deer, or those mounts, but me. I feel the same about my name being in a book. Nobody but me would care, and my name being in a book doesn't make me feel anything either. When I look at the buck (soon to be bucks!) on my wall I remember the rollercoaster of emotions, the time, the effort, the sacrifice, and everything else that came with that experience... it means alot. Others may come in my house and say "that's a nice buck", but that's as much as it means to them. A name in a book, to me seems worthless. But that's just for me, and I think it's absolutely awesome for you if that means something to you. Anyone who has any distaste for B&C or P&Y I feel like it's due to a specific bad experience, such as a couple of stories mentioned in this thread.


It sounded to me like you did everything you could to recover that animal and that is the intent of what P&Y is after with their rulings. From their position statement "It is the responsibility of all hunters to give total effort to recover an animal by track and trail until every reasonable possibility has been exhausted." I assume you wrapped your buck tag on him and called it good for the season with that tag/buck? If it were me I would say I would allow that. The hunt in between gets a little dangerous though. Had a beautiful 180" buck walked by would you have just let him go? Your statement sounds to me like you did it in pursuit of the one you shot (aka still trying to recover him)

There was a moose that was killed by a bowhunter not too many years ago. The hunter and outfitter watched the double lunged moose swim into the middle of a lake and to the shock of both hunter and outfitter, he sank (they normally float). The next morning when they went to recover him, the lake had frozen over. The hunter came back the next spring and had arranged for the carcass to be retrieved from the lake. In talking with a club member there was a lot of discussion on this one, but they allowed the animal in as the hunter ended his hunting and made every effort he could to retrieve the animal! Incredible.



Yes, I did my best to recover the buck I shot, but 24 hours after the shot all I knew was that he was still alive. I had no idea if he would survive and recover from the injury, or if/when he would die. I had a restless nights before going back in with the dog tracker, and then even more so after bumping him still alive the next day. That buck was all I could think about. Was he alive? was he going to survive? or was he dead the next day? it was eating away at me. So, yes, I did go back to hunt that area 2 days later with hopes of seeing that buck. If I did not see that same buck and a B&C caliber buck walked by me, I can honestly say I would have shot the B&C buck... I mean I knew "my" buck was still alive 24 hours later. As soon as I saw him, I did notch my tag. Because it was a gut shot, recovered 3 days after the shot, and a vulture had plucked his eyes out and chewed on his lip, I didn't feel comfortable taking the meat home to feed my family. It was absolutely heartbreaking leaving the body behind and taking the head with me. Before that moment I would have been majorly pissed off if I found a buck body with its head cut off, but after that I understood there are circumstances that may make that a reasonable option. I decided I needed to have the shoulder mount done because that buck meant alot to me, and the entire experience was a rollercoaster of emotions that I will never forget. He was also my first mature buck taken with my bow on public land. Like I said before, I am not concerned with getting him in the P&Y books, and have not even considered it really. After reading your post, I was just curious if that situation was a disqualification.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby James » Sat Jan 15, 2022 4:07 pm

Brad wrote:
James wrote:
Brad wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.




That's a very interesting story. I feel bad for that kid too. Maybe you know the answer to this, but it brings up a question regarding my situation this year. My buck was not a B&C caliber deer, but surpassed P&Y (144 3/8" per my taxidermist). I shot the buck around 5:20 pm on Nov 3rd, then went back with a tracker the next day. We ended up bumping the buck (obviously still alive) about 24 hours after the shot. I went back to the location to "hunt", mainly to see if I could get eyes on the same buck... & not surprising to me I didn't see one deer that day in the stand. I got down and decided to get downwind of where I thought this buck bedded, then get aggressive and work my way into the bedding area, just to see if he was around and still alive for closure and later hunting intel. I got to a creek drainage and saw a vulture fly up from behind some brush further down the creek... I knew I had to go look, and found my buck there around 11 am on Nov 6th. If he were a B&C caliber deer, would he be allowed in the books in that situation?

I don't think there is a great deal of distaste for B&C or P&Y. For me it's more of an indifference. I have no desire to get my name in a book. I have only the one buck that would be eligible for P&Y (unless the above story disqualifies mine... ). I hunt only for me. I have no desire for any notoriety, no desire for my name being in a book, and no desire to impress anyone else. Pretty soon I will have my second shoulder mount on my wall, and honestly nobody gives a crap about those deer, or those mounts, but me. I feel the same about my name being in a book. Nobody but me would care, and my name being in a book doesn't make me feel anything either. When I look at the buck (soon to be bucks!) on my wall I remember the rollercoaster of emotions, the time, the effort, the sacrifice, and everything else that came with that experience... it means alot. Others may come in my house and say "that's a nice buck", but that's as much as it means to them. A name in a book, to me seems worthless. But that's just for me, and I think it's absolutely awesome for you if that means something to you. Anyone who has any distaste for B&C or P&Y I feel like it's due to a specific bad experience, such as a couple of stories mentioned in this thread.


It sounded to me like you did everything you could to recover that animal and that is the intent of what P&Y is after with their rulings. From their position statement "It is the responsibility of all hunters to give total effort to recover an animal by track and trail until every reasonable possibility has been exhausted." I assume you wrapped your buck tag on him and called it good for the season with that tag/buck? If it were me I would say I would allow that. The hunt in between gets a little dangerous though. Had a beautiful 180" buck walked by would you have just let him go? Your statement sounds to me like you did it in pursuit of the one you shot (aka still trying to recover him)

There was a moose that was killed by a bowhunter not too many years ago. The hunter and outfitter watched the double lunged moose swim into the middle of a lake and to the shock of both hunter and outfitter, he sank (they normally float). The next morning when they went to recover him, the lake had frozen over. The hunter came back the next spring and had arranged for the carcass to be retrieved from the lake. In talking with a club member there was a lot of discussion on this one, but they allowed the animal in as the hunter ended his hunting and made every effort he could to retrieve the animal! Incredible.



Yes, I did my best to recover the buck I shot, but 24 hours after the shot all I knew was that he was still alive. I had no idea if he would survive and recover from the injury, or if/when he would die. I had a restless nights before going back in with the dog tracker, and then even more so after bumping him still alive the next day. That buck was all I could think about. Was he alive? was he going to survive? or was he dead the next day? it was eating away at me. So, yes, I did go back to hunt that area 2 days later with hopes of seeing that buck. If I did not see that same buck and a B&C caliber buck walked by me, I can honestly say I would have shot the B&C buck... I mean I knew "my" buck was still alive 24 hours later. As soon as I saw him, I did notch my tag. Because it was a gut shot, recovered 3 days after the shot, and a vulture had plucked his eyes out and chewed on his lip, I didn't feel comfortable taking the meat home to feed my family. It was absolutely heartbreaking leaving the body behind and taking the head with me. Before that moment I would have been majorly pissed off if I found a buck body with its head cut off, but after that I understood there are circumstances that may make that a reasonable option. I decided I needed to have the shoulder mount done because that buck meant alot to me, and the entire experience was a rollercoaster of emotions that I will never forget. He was also my first mature buck taken with my bow on public land. Like I said before, I am not concerned with getting him in the P&Y books, and have not even considered it really. After reading your post, I was just curious if that situation was a disqualification.


My take is that they would let you enter it. You did kill it with your arrow and did everything you could to recover it and legally tagged it. and eventually did!!
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby James » Sat Jan 15, 2022 4:08 pm

Brad wrote:
James wrote:
Brad wrote:
James wrote:I’ll share a quick story from the other side of the coin on the measurer side just for some juxtaposition. At the last measuring event I was at, a young gentlemen brought in a gorgeous whitetail buck. I can’t remember the official score, but I believe it made B&C net. It was big. I wasn’t the one scoring it. I was working on another that just made the book!

The young man said he would like to enter the buck. He went through his entry form and got to the fair chase affidavit. There is a section on search and recovery. If you did not recover the animal the same day you need to include a full write up of the circumstances. In this case he stated that he had shot the buck earlier in the fall, and then later recovered the deer during gun season (found it). The official measurer asked him, well did you continue to hunt for a buck in between shooting it and the recovery and he stated that he did (indicating the search was abandoned). In this case the rules are clear the animal cannot be entered into the record book unfortunately. Like it or not, this was the situation.

This young man appeared to be a really solid person. He did not do anything wrong ethically in my opinion. But rules are rules. You could imagine the same sort of situation where perhaps someone uses a long recovery period in hopes they might kill a bigger buck, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to see why the rule around abandoned search needs to exist.

In any case, both sides were incredibly gracious in the exchange. The measurer REALLY felt for this kid and was super bummed he couldn’t put it in the books for him. The kid was bummed, but understood. He and his dad stayed a while and chatted more. I believe the kid actually had another great buck he had shot with his rifle or maybe a different bow season and he did enter that one! Can’t remember if same season or not.

Anyways, wanted to share that perspective. You could see where that story morphs and a jaded individual starts throwing some shade at the entire situation.




That's a very interesting story. I feel bad for that kid too. Maybe you know the answer to this, but it brings up a question regarding my situation this year. My buck was not a B&C caliber deer, but surpassed P&Y (144 3/8" per my taxidermist). I shot the buck around 5:20 pm on Nov 3rd, then went back with a tracker the next day. We ended up bumping the buck (obviously still alive) about 24 hours after the shot. I went back to the location to "hunt", mainly to see if I could get eyes on the same buck... & not surprising to me I didn't see one deer that day in the stand. I got down and decided to get downwind of where I thought this buck bedded, then get aggressive and work my way into the bedding area, just to see if he was around and still alive for closure and later hunting intel. I got to a creek drainage and saw a vulture fly up from behind some brush further down the creek... I knew I had to go look, and found my buck there around 11 am on Nov 6th. If he were a B&C caliber deer, would he be allowed in the books in that situation?

I don't think there is a great deal of distaste for B&C or P&Y. For me it's more of an indifference. I have no desire to get my name in a book. I have only the one buck that would be eligible for P&Y (unless the above story disqualifies mine... ). I hunt only for me. I have no desire for any notoriety, no desire for my name being in a book, and no desire to impress anyone else. Pretty soon I will have my second shoulder mount on my wall, and honestly nobody gives a crap about those deer, or those mounts, but me. I feel the same about my name being in a book. Nobody but me would care, and my name being in a book doesn't make me feel anything either. When I look at the buck (soon to be bucks!) on my wall I remember the rollercoaster of emotions, the time, the effort, the sacrifice, and everything else that came with that experience... it means alot. Others may come in my house and say "that's a nice buck", but that's as much as it means to them. A name in a book, to me seems worthless. But that's just for me, and I think it's absolutely awesome for you if that means something to you. Anyone who has any distaste for B&C or P&Y I feel like it's due to a specific bad experience, such as a couple of stories mentioned in this thread.


It sounded to me like you did everything you could to recover that animal and that is the intent of what P&Y is after with their rulings. From their position statement "It is the responsibility of all hunters to give total effort to recover an animal by track and trail until every reasonable possibility has been exhausted." I assume you wrapped your buck tag on him and called it good for the season with that tag/buck? If it were me I would say I would allow that. The hunt in between gets a little dangerous though. Had a beautiful 180" buck walked by would you have just let him go? Your statement sounds to me like you did it in pursuit of the one you shot (aka still trying to recover him)

There was a moose that was killed by a bowhunter not too many years ago. The hunter and outfitter watched the double lunged moose swim into the middle of a lake and to the shock of both hunter and outfitter, he sank (they normally float). The next morning when they went to recover him, the lake had frozen over. The hunter came back the next spring and had arranged for the carcass to be retrieved from the lake. In talking with a club member there was a lot of discussion on this one, but they allowed the animal in as the hunter ended his hunting and made every effort he could to retrieve the animal! Incredible.



Yes, I did my best to recover the buck I shot, but 24 hours after the shot all I knew was that he was still alive. I had no idea if he would survive and recover from the injury, or if/when he would die. I had a restless nights before going back in with the dog tracker, and then even more so after bumping him still alive the next day. That buck was all I could think about. Was he alive? was he going to survive? or was he dead the next day? it was eating away at me. So, yes, I did go back to hunt that area 2 days later with hopes of seeing that buck. If I did not see that same buck and a B&C caliber buck walked by me, I can honestly say I would have shot the B&C buck... I mean I knew "my" buck was still alive 24 hours later. As soon as I saw him, I did notch my tag. Because it was a gut shot, recovered 3 days after the shot, and a vulture had plucked his eyes out and chewed on his lip, I didn't feel comfortable taking the meat home to feed my family. It was absolutely heartbreaking leaving the body behind and taking the head with me. Before that moment I would have been majorly pissed off if I found a buck body with its head cut off, but after that I understood there are circumstances that may make that a reasonable option. I decided I needed to have the shoulder mount done because that buck meant alot to me, and the entire experience was a rollercoaster of emotions that I will never forget. He was also my first mature buck taken with my bow on public land. Like I said before, I am not concerned with getting him in the P&Y books, and have not even considered it really. After reading your post, I was just curious if that situation was a disqualification.


My take is that they would let you enter it. You did kill it with your arrow and did everything you could to recover it and legally tagged it. and you eventually did recover it! Congrats. The meat and heartache is a bummer, but you did what you needed to
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby <DK> » Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:48 am

Baron.freeman wrote:
Jackson Marsh wrote:
Baron.freeman wrote:I'm new to this but got a pretty good example this year. I don't want to be in there b&c club or prolly won't have it professionally measured but I killed a public land buck in southern ohio this past November 23rd. (Didn't find it til the 24th). I think it would make b&c. I had it at 183gross around 171 with deductions. I pretty much killed him off a cell cam. I set the cell cam in August in the heat of summer. It was on exit of doe bedding cause i basically was out showing my wife the process. Well it took lots of pics of doe til November 13th then the buck showed up. I took pics of him Nov. 13, 14, 16, 18, 20, 22 then killed him on 23rd. On the 18th I went for evening hunt picked a tree then for some reason moved 30 yds to another tree bumped him and the four doe. On the 23rd thr game plan was the same just in the morning. It all worked out. But the reason I say I killed him from cell cam is cause I wasn't going to hunt ohio til December and late season. I killed my buck in Indiana Oct 16th and didn't want to deal with public land frenzy in southern ohio during November. So I was being patient. But after 4 days of him being in area I had enough and tried on the 18th and jumped him. Figured it was over with well after knowing he was still there I went back and killed him. Is this against there rules? I scouted and set it in the summer. Then when I went on 18th my parking lot was closed so I talked to DNR they told me another parking spot. It looked like I was parking in someone's yard but I could access him. It ended up being a 2.89 mile walk. So I worked for it but I did kill him from a cell cam cause i wouldn't have been there yet. I didn't get a pic and run out and shoot him. I live 3 hrs away I had to make plans, get off work and leave at 2 in the morning. But it was all cause a cell cam.




Some would say that's not fair chase ( not me) but I don't see the difference in what you did versus having Intel like glassing or a buddy saying a big boy just showed up and you better get your tail over here and hunt. How many times has an outfitter told a big name TV show guy to come hunt because he had a big buck patterned for him and it would make great video? I think that happens all the time, especially for the big name guys.


We also need a pic of this buck :D


Hey! This came across my feed, what a coincidence lol

https://fb.watch/azWq39rBjd/

Did the deer have any hair left on its rear end? :lol:
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Grizzlyadam » Wed Jan 19, 2022 2:27 am

I know of guys who have permission on small suburban private yards where they set up a stand over a feed station and monitor it with a cell cam. They wait for a target buck to show up then they go sit there and shoot it so they can post selfies on fakebook. Nothing to be proud of there imo.


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